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Rangers fan Alasdair McKillop responds to Phil Mac Giolla Bhain's claims about Scottish Football without Rangers Football Club.
Phil Mac Giolla Bhain, the prophet of Donegal, is a tenacious and committed journalist. Those who visit his blog on a regular basis will be well aware that the financial health of Rangers has been a major preoccupation of his for quite some time.
He has excoriated mainstream Scottish sport journalism for what he sees as it’s craven failure to reveal the full details of the implications the HMRC tribunal and other shady goings on at Edmiston Drive. This, he argues, has been left to new media journalists like himself and those who post on the Rangers Tax Case site. He certainly cannot be accused of being afflicted with modesty.
My concern, in responding to some of Phil’s assertions, is not to engage with any post-tax bill scenarios for the club itself but rather to respond to some of his claims about Scottish football without Rangers and, more importantly, challenge him about the way he talks about my football club.
It would be churlish not to acknowledge that Rangers are in a perilous condition, one almost without precedent in the club’s history. Rangers fans are well aware of this but not because of the endeavours of Mac Giolla Bhain.
In his recent Scotzine piece, Mac Giolla Bhain paints an optimistic picture of the landscape of Scottish football post-Rangers. He predicts that, following an admitted period of Celtic dominance, Scottish football would return to an era of relative competitiveness as other teams benefited from demoralised and chastised local Rangers fans coming through the turnstiles.
Meanwhile, for reasons that remain unclear, more young Scottish players would make the breakthrough. This neat analysis parcels up the ills of Scottish football and delivers them to the front door at Ibrox while conveniently bypassing the complexity of the problems not enough good young Scottish footballers, it’s because Rangers exist-and the complicity of his own club.
It is hard not to read it as a plea to fans of other SPL clubs to join with Celtic in banishing Rangers for the collective good of Scottish football. Beware the wolf in sheep’s clothing.
I agree that a collapse of Rangers, to the extent that it was, for one reason or another, no longer able to compete in the SPL, would be of immediate benefit to Celtic but I see no reason for believing that Celtic would only dominate ‘for a while’ after which other teams would then be credible challengers for the title.
Celtic would stand to gain immensely from repeatedly winning the SPL title and the potential Champions League revenue this might entail. Such revenue could, and probably would, be utilised to maintain a large spending disparity between Celtic and the other teams in the SPL after the major collective source of income – television money – had been decimated because of the loss of the four Old Firm games each season. This is despite the totally hypothetical scenario which sees Rangers supporters suddenly being converted to follow teams such as Kilmarnock and Motherwell.
This, of course, draws on the well worn argument that Rangers attract fans from across Scotland to the detriment of smaller teams such as the ones mentioned above. There seems to be an undeniable element of truth to this but what has been omitted is the charge that Celtic is equally culpable. Furthermore, it is also possible to read into this argument, as presented by Mac Giolla Bhain, the idea that Rangers fans posses some sort of false consciousness: they aren’t really fans of Rangers Football Club, they are just drawn to the club because it is the ‘nexus’ of the kind of anti-Irish and anti-Catholic bigotry that they have a primordial desire to revel in.
Phil’s analysis, in short, permits no other reasons why an individual might support Rangers and I find this deeply offensive. Because he doesn’t seem to believe that Rangers fans can take pride in their club or follow it according to the same impulses that animate other football fans, he seriously underestimates the great collective energy that would be unleashed should Rangers, in it’s current form, collapse.
It is likely that the Rangers support would be engaged in a process of trying to resuscitate their ailing club for a considerable number of years afterwards, thus severely limiting the transfer of allegiances required to make Mac Giolla Bhain’s scenario even slightly plausible.
According to Mac Giolla Bhain, Scottish society would also benefit from ‘the extinction of Rangers’, describing the club as a ‘grand central stain on Scottish football and Scottish society’. These are remarkable words only if you are unfamiliar with his previous writing. I ask him what his response would be if I were to employ the same words in an attack on his football club? Would he not accuse me of anti-Irish racism and anti-Catholicism?
How exactly would the hundreds of thousands Rangers fans, who would be losing their club, benefit? Supporting Rangers can mean any number of things. Like its Old Firm counterpart, Rangers represents, for some, a totem of a way of life or a culture that no longer exists. And, moreover, one that was about more than anti-Irish racism and anti-Catholic hatred (but wait, I thought these were the same thing?). For some it is a chance to celebrate a sense of British identity that seems to be severely discounted in the public discourse of modern Scotland, this despite the fact that Rangers continue to be labelled ‘the establishment club’-a label that has no meaning and no correspondence to reality. Going to Ibrox is a way for young men employed in call centres to commune with the ghosts of their grandfathers who built great ships that were the envy of the world.
Finally, he claims Rangers were ‘a creation of Imperialist North Britain’. Well yes, in the narrow sense that they were founded during the Victorian heyday of the British Empire. The club was the product of a massive upsurge in the popularity of association football that was one of the defining social developments of the era. Applying this criteria, here are some other teams that were a creation of ‘Imperialist North Britain’: Dumbarton, Hibernian, Queen’s Park, St. Mirren and Celtic.
Queen Victoria was not the first manager of Rangers. This is a little known fact but you could be forgiven for thinking otherwise. Rangers squads did not spend the time between seasons actively helping to colonise Africa. Mac Giolla Bhain’s writing about Rangers, writing about his own club is a less frequent occurrence often exudes a subdued viciousness that every now and then bubbles to the surface but he seems oblivious to the fact that his own attitudes come perilously close to being the mirror image of those he claims to deplore. The psychological landscape of Scottish football will only change when the psychological landscape of those involved has changed.
On a further note, in regards to ‘a player from the Republic of Ireland in their first team’. Rangers tried to sign Ray Houghton before they signed Maurice Johnston, it was those of a Celtic-minded persuasion who scuppered the deal.
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Blah blah blah, Phil knew what was going on, posted it on the internet and the NOTW, the compliant laptop loyal refused to believe it, and when they found there was a lot of truth in it, they buried it as well as their collective heads in the sand. Celtic supporters mobilised on the old board when it became obvious from the pro Rangers’ media who couldn’t contain their laughter, well the same hacks have done our job for us, in not reporting the truth, if there was anyone out there who may have saved Rangers, it is now too late for them to do anything about it, it is a runaway train heading for a cliff with Whytey at the controls.
Rangers (along with Celtic), have tried and still aspire to play in the EPL, and they are open minded about the potential of joining some kind of European League. If Rangers and those in the media believe it would “decimate” ,”destroy”, “ruin”, the whole of scottish football if Rangers were not in the SPL if the worst happened. Why were Rangers and the scottish media not bothered about by the thought of “destroying” scottish football by losing BOTH Glasgow clubs?
Same old nonsense from a Rangers fan you can’t survive without us. Well in my opinion we the Celtic fans can’t survive with Rangers in their present form.
Not only have Rangers destroyed Scottish football with their massive over spending spree, at the tax payers expense not once have I heard one word off apology or regret.
The Rangers support will have to learn they have no god given right to win.
So don’t try and blame Celtic fans or any others fans for your demise.
How much ticket money has been spent by fans while playing against a stacked deck.
So to all Rangers fans place the blame closer to home have a look a the way your clubs been run.
I know if Rangers are not punished to the extreme. The dodgy dealings will continue.
I find this a strange blog to answer, the writer condemns Phil for reporting THE TRUTH?
He takes offence that Phil comments on the Rangers situation, quoting facts, time & again, & ignores that senior RFC personnel have confirmed he was right… Eventually.
I have read his comments on anti Irish bigotry, & have seen the evidence to substantiate his blogs on this.
Your blog then says that Scottish Football, at the highest level ,could not survive without Rangers…
SPL can’t survives without Rangers?
Historical ignorance, Pre Sounesss, Rangers were not a team in the ascendancy & Aberdeen & Dundee United were in the main, the teams on the ball.
In the years of Scottish Football, Pre Souness/Murray’s inflated mince, The Best of Scottish Players moved for a fee, this kept Scottish clubs solvent, Most succesfull English Teams had Scottish players, some, like Law made it , Really big time, abroad.
Young Scottish players would be given the chance because the artificially high level of renumeration paid to foreign players has all but disappeared.
I am in my 60′s, I watched Celtic, Aberdeen & Dundee United, go & make Scotland proud.
I watched Falkirk play Celtic & the field was ALIVE with YOUNG talent.
If a level playing field was established, it could be all young SCOTTISH Talent.
In short, Scottish Football doesn’t NEED your team & the arrogance portrayed by the likes of you makes me hope for a better set up without you.
Why did those teams do Scotland proud but a team of Scots who won a european trophy in seventies did not?
Because their FANS RIOTED & proved they were Scotland’s Shame.
Can i also ask Ian how many of the current celtic first team are scots? I make it less than 25% – is that Ranger’s fault?
Read what I actually wrote, not what you want to read, I said the recent Celtic v Falkirk was alive with young talent & that if a level playing field was established it could be ALL Scottish talent in the future.
Celtic have taken young talented players from around the world & are creating a successful model by doing so, they are also developing young Scots talent & I hope they & other teams will do so in the future.
No YOU said.
“Young Scottish Players would be given the chance because the artificially high remuneration paid to foreign players has all but disappeared¬
So again I ask you if this is the case why do Celtic only have a couple of Scottish Players in the first 11? You are trying to stretch a point that the EBTs damaged young Scottish Talent? Ironically enough, Rangers Now rely strongly on Scottish talent and Celtic fans will be quick to tell you haw much better their own team is – can’t have it both ways.
Gordon, not only Rangers had foreign players that their budgets could not afford, whether paid by EBT or not.
Celtic spent more than they could afford, I class Sutton, Hartson etc as being in that catagory.
Again, I ask you to read what I wrote in TOTAL, do not take one paragraph & try & turn it.
Celtic have a model which is based on attracting young players, I mentioned the Celtic v Falkirk as a good advert for young players & said I would like to see it being ALL Scottish youth as time goes on.
I find it strange that you make a point of how few Scottish players Celtic have & emphisise that Rangers now rely on Scottish talent.
I don’t know which Rangers team YOU are referring to, it must be Berwick.
On Saturday Rangers fielded EIGHT foreign players & used TWO foreign subs.
THE TRUTH?
He’s been predicting administration for Rangers every Friday since last August.
Said Craig Whyte would never takeover Rangers ‘#fakeover’ if I recall correctly.
Has broken all these ‘exclusives’ and yet still hasn’t been snapped up by any MSM outlets.
Nice editing of my comment yet you headline your blog by insinuating he’s a ‘prophet’.
Celtzine got something to hide also? Guess that will come clean in the wash also.
Mark certain comments made could be deemed libellious and therefore we edit them. I never stated that he was a prophet if you look at the first paragraph it was a comment made in jest by the article author – please get your facts straight before claiming that it was myself who is insinuating something.
Ok. I’ll rephrase it like this.
I’ve always wondered why two ‘controversial’ internet authors in Phil & David Leggat used foreign hosting companies when targeting & talking to a mainly West of Scotland audience…
It’s not as though there wasn’t UK domains on those names. Anyone know?
Easy to answer Mark – cheaper hosting costs than those offered in the UK. Leggat’s site, however, is a free hosting site from blogspot.
Yeah maybe cheaper but libel laws can maje it more attractive also #justsaying.
Libel laws are still relevant where Phil has his site hosted – free websites such as leggat’s escape such libel laws because the hosting companies providing the free space most of the time use an easy get out clause in their terms and conditions.
Sorry for the late reply Mark,
I missed your comment.
I watch & read the MSM, Phil’s accuracy is better than the mainstream norm.
I didn’t call him a prophet , but hey, he’s easier to read than Nostradamus & maybe more accurate
Typical Rangers supporters – Paranoid & Delusional.
Jelly & ice cream anyone?
Strange that there is no mention of Rangers ‘operation no Catholics’.
“Going to Ibrox was a way to commune with the ghosts of their grandfathers who built great ships, that were the envy of the world” Was that in the shipyards that wouldn,t employ any Catholics?
Ian Ferguson,
Quick question for you… Would you describe Phil’s reports as impartial? / Unbiased? / Unprejudiced?
I don’t suppose you want to back this up with facts do you? Where in history is there any mention of discrimination against catholics in Glasgow shipyards? My Father worked in shipyards and what he speaks about is if the foreman was a catholic, he started catholics, if he was a protestant, he started protestants.
What a huge insult to the men who stood shoulder to shoulder and fought for their jobs in the famous work in led by the likes of Jimmy Reid – this is simply made up.
Gordon it isn’t made up – a lot of workers came over from Belfast from Halland and Wolff [spelling?] yards to work in Clyde yards – this occurred before WW1 and interwar years. And in terms of the religion of the foremen etc they were Protestant and they did not hire Catholics at that time. All changed during WW2 and thereafter though.
My family has worked in Clyde shipyards for over 30-40 years just for reference purposes.
Andy, this is fact? Ok if it is fact then it ended in 1939 – over 70 years ago. So how far do you want to go back? This is the problem – amazingly enough Phil bangs on about the empire and the guilt British people should feel. In that case we should constantly remind Modern Germany about Adolf Hitler and cheered as the Tsunami swept over parts of Japan? We are in real danger of stepping back in time in this country.
FYI Andy, my Dad is 77 years old and worked in the yards from the early fifties to the early eighties which would be from an era after the period you speak about that would make his memories of the yard spot on.
I
Quick answer, the Blog is a reply to Phil & I answered the CONTENT of the blog.
I would say that Phil’s Blog is, in the main, TRUE.
Ian – I have been asking for evidence of the anti-irish and anti-catholic rant Phil goes on and I must be reading a different blog to you – where is the evidence? The only thing Phil offered wa a very dodgy parity arguement lifted for Prof Tom Devine that compared American immigration to Scottish immigration.
Alasdair is raising something about Phil which is spot on. That all Rangers supporters are there to pound the poor catholic or to fight for a lost empire or some similar garbage.
As a Scotsman and Rangers fan married to my lovely Catholic wife whose Irish Catholic Grandmother was a woman I ioved and admired. A woman who as a fifteen year old girl was forced to sail from Ireland to Stornaway to gut fish 6 days a week as her family were so poor in Ireland. As a Scotsman and a Rangers fan whose Irish Protestant Great Grandad fell dead on the first day of the battle of the Somme at the age of 24. As a Scotsman and Rangers fan I find it disgusting that this half brain sits and stirs up hatred in this country and blocks everyone who wants engage and challeng his arguements with him and then has the audacity to slander fellow journalists for being the laptop loyal
What happens to Rangers will happen to Rangers and the debate and arguements will rumble on. I am more concerned that we stop this rubbish about anti-irishnes and ant-catholic in this country and move on. On Phils’s site you have his sycophants telling us they are discriminated against everyday but then cannot offer the simplest example or evidence of it.
Then you’ll be able to identify with Alex Ferguson who refused point blank to become your manager for the way he was treated for his marital choice. There’s one example.
That would be Alex Ferguson who was in The Rangers dressing room celebrating when they beat Leeds at Elland Road? Does not strike me as the forgiving type.
Gordon, do you read history at all?
Scotland has a history of militant Anti Catholic religious fervour going back to before the time of James I of Britain.
His colonisation of Ireland by militant Protestants & their empowerment, is still reflected in the situation in the six Ulster counties retained by Britain.
James II, was Anglican, verging on Catholic in his beliefs & pro France.
In Europe there was a coalition of states who opposed France. William of Orange was a General in this opposition & the coalition was supported by the Pope.
William was married to Mary, the daughter of James II & both he & his wife were Protestant.
James II had a late son & the fear of a Catholic Monarchy led to the invitation of William & Mary to assume the Throne.
When the fighting was over & William had won, the Glorious Revolution was introduced into Britain.
It was not very Glorious for Catholics, they had no vote, could not sit in Parliament, could not hold an army commission, the Monarch was forbidden to be a Catholic or marry one ( this STILL applies today.)
During troubles between the native Irish & the Protestant planters the Orange Order was formed.
The Orange Order was, in turn, introduced to Scotland by returning soldiers who had been stationed in Ireland, it was & is anti Irish & anti Catholic & forms a large part of the anti Catholic feelings in Scotland today.
When Struth went down the road he took at Rangers, The Kirk & The Orange Order became active in their support of the anti Catholic & especially Anti Irish Catholic stance & this provided a focal point for the Protestant Scots & their Anti Papish attitudes, in the face of an Irish infux which had began with the famine & had grown since.
The Kirk in the 1930′s even preached & supported mass Forced repatriation of the Irish back to Ireland. It has since apologised for it’s Anti Irish Catholic stance.
In the job market it was common not to employ a Catholic, the old ” what school did you attend” question on the form made it easy.
The ingrained anti Pope, anti Catholic, especially anti Irish Catholic ethos is alive & well in Scotland & can be seen marching in a town near you during the “Marching Season” & takes a lot of it’s venom from the ongoing situation in the six counties of Ulster.
What is a Croppy & why should he lie down?
What is a Taig & what makes them the object of this hatred?
Why would you want to be up to your knees in anyone’s blood, never mind a fellow citizen of the country where you live & then, only because they are of a different religious persuasion from you?
Why is there such a hatred of the Pope? In the “King Billy” war the pope supported him & there is a painting in Stormont depicting this, or there was before it was damaged by a Scottish delagation on a visit, I am not sure where it is now. But is it not amazing that a Scottish Bigot could go to Ulster & outdo the fine citizens of that province in anti pope behaviour?
In a modern age it beggers belief, & Gordon if you don’t believe me go out & listen & watch during the said marching season, in fact listen to the singing at Ibrox, but hey I forgot, that’s only “Black Humour”
Ian, the offence taken is not about Rangers FC catastrophic finances – it is Phil’s horrible and abusive branding of the of Rangers fans and his insulting digs sweeping statements – I think both sets of fans are guilty of things but I also think away from the football we do not have serious problem thank God.
Hello again Gordon,
My main issue has been the on the financial side & how I can’t accept, if it is proven that RFC did cheat, a deal to let them off the hook ” for the good of Scottish football”.
If it resulted in an insolvency then the Newco has no right to entry into the SPL & should not be allowed to do so.
No other team, in a similar situation to Rangers, would be granted this. Would Hearts or Killie?
On the issues which attach themselves to the “Old Firm” I have to admit I am genuinely worried about it.
I look at the NI situation & it could be reflected quite easily in Scotland, there are enough Bams on both sides of the religious divide to make it happen.
I think the Scottish Government, by their intervention, have only blurred the issue. It exists & should be tackled on both sides.
If it were Muslim, Jewish etc it would not be tolerated.
Thanks for the history lesson Ian, this is 2012! I have no idea why people want to talk about James 1 of Britain apart from a history lesson in 2012. There is a massive chip needing removed from the shoulder here. The Orange Lodge mentioned without mentioning the Hibs Walk? Why? The Orange Lodge is a stain on Scotland in my opinion and anyone I know in it tends to be fairly ignorant and in need of a sense of belonging and self importance. Most modern thought is membership was always greatly overstated and in decline.
I ask for examples of day to day examples of anti-catholic and anti-Irish action in Scotland and all I get is history lessons – 1930s? 80 years ago? Listen, if there is this massive and real anti-catholic feeling where was the demos and anger at the Pope’s visit? That shows how much people really care – Ian what is a Hun?
Gordon, it is a LIVING History of the Nation,it does not stop at a certain date, it is ongoing.
Your comments on the Orange Order are interesting but miss the point.
Because they are in decline does not make their Anti Irish rascism & Anti Catholic bigotry any more acceptable.
The fact that it is tolerated & embraced, is a disgrace in a supposedly modern multi cultural society, as I already mentioned, if it was anti Muslim or Jewish it would not be tolerated.
The problem in Scotland is that it is not faced up to but is ignored, renamed or just found to be acceptable.
The Scottish Police are guilty of it, as are some Politicians. Is it a matter of what they are used to, so they don’t find it offensive?
I found it strange that for all the Mass illegal singing of the Famine song & Billy Boys etc the Police have never taken action nor found it a requirement to report it to football authorities, but found it necessary to report singing by Celtic fans, surely they don’t find one sections singing acceptable & the other not?
It would appear that this is true, after the majority of Ranger’s Fans sang the illegal Famine Song at the Cup Final they were congratulated by BOTH the Police & Politicians for their behaviour. That indicates institustionalised rascism.
“The collective failure of an organisation to provide an appropriate and professional service to people because of their colour, culture, or ethnic origin. It can be seen or detected in processes, attitudes and behaviour which amount to discrimination through unwitting prejudice, ignorance, thoughtlessness and racist stereotyping which disadvantage minority ethnic people.”
I find this is what happens, ordinary Scots ignore it, or maybe don’t even notice it, it is so ingrained.
In Scotland it is rewritten as Sectarian behavior, but it is not, although in some cases it is both.
When young guys who decided to play for the Republic of Ireland were vilified & abused, it was their fault for not playing for the counrty of their birth, yet the abuse was all anti Irish.
Why was it wrong for them to chose the land of their forefathers but it is ok for othersto do so? Many players have chosen Scotland although born elsewhere.
Neil Lennon? enough said it was all his own fault, apparently.
What did the Hibs Manager do to deserve the Anti Irish diatribe he suffered throughout a recent game?
He was abused throughout a match, it was all anti Irish but the police took no action. Why is this acceptable, why do the Police continually ignore it ?
If it is not rascist abuse what is it?
For what my opinion on marching is worth, I would BAN both the Orange Order & Hibernian Walks, I feel that they have no place in a modern Scotland & only cause old wounds to fester.
They have a completely different flavour than, say St Patrick’s Day celebrations in NY & elsewhere.
Ian, this is where we disagree -
I dont think racism, bigotry etc are acceptable (where did I say that) but the degree to which it exists I debate
The stats suggest that there are much bigger social problems in Scotland Drugs, Domestic Abuse, Racism of Asians etc – But you cannot say Scotland is awash with drugs – Scotland is a Racist Country – Scotland is a country of wife beaters. These are social problems but all countires have social problems.
I ask you Ian, when the OF fans were throwing out insults and hate to each other and the Rangers fans sung the famine song was there was a collective intake of breath from the Celtic fans, hurt to the core saying “No that is just too far?” Some of the same fans who tried for years to suggest that a former Rangers captain was a pedophile? Hoping it was true? I don’t think so. More a bandwagon to have a go at the club. Are they that sensitive?
I think you need to prove your case and offer a lot of quality evidence to suggest the police are institutionally racist – to suggest that they are guilty of this because they praised the general behaviour of fans at a football match in which the famine song i sung is a nonsense. I think the police will be looking at arrest, drunkeness, violence inside and outside the ground over a 5/6 hour period. Quite rightly they will be more interested in public disorder and safety.
The victimisation of young men wanting to play for the country of their forefathers is always raised but when Kyle Lafferty appears in court as a witness against a Celtic fan following him around a supermarket abusing him and talks about the daily secterian abuse he suffers, Phil and others like him fail to mention it? Why? Because that does not fit in with the obsession that Scotland is an anti-catholic country.
Neil Lennon is a unpopular manager outside of Celtic fans. That is far removed from the bombs and bullets – that is disgusting and the Police actually did an excellent job to make two arrests in this case. But the insistance that Lennon is particularly hated is soley related to his Irish and religious identy is nonsense. Everbody hated Souness outside Rangers and I can understand that. MON was not hated as much as Lennon outside Celtic. He was an Northern Irish Catholic like Lennon. Human nature.
As for Pat Fenlon, ask him what his reception was like in Dublin after he played for Linfield. None of it acceptable but not exclusively Scottish. I was a guest at a Celtic Motherwell game , the Motherwell manager was taking some abuse about his days as a Rangers player – to his credit McCall laughed it off – what’s the difference? Oh yeah, McCall is not Irish so that does not count.